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Ecclesial
AGG Member
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Thu Mar 18th, 2010 01:52 am |
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I have been restoring church windows for several decades now and never had the opportunity to handle these pivots before. I have always restored the tilt and lift operators. Hope someone can help!
The pivots are a hub design with two curved metal pieces that float inside the hub on either side of the frame. The pivot is attached securely to the operator by substantial peened rivets. The church is located in downstate Illinois, built in 1933.
I have attached a picture of the inside of the window in the hopes that someone would have a solution to removing these operators without removing the frame. As you can see by the picture, the frames are set deep in concrete and plaster with thick brick on the outside. Removing the frames would mean substantial plaster work inside.
I have seen these before, but never had the pleasure of working with them until now.
Attached Image (viewed 94 times):
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Roberto
AGG Member
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Posted: Thu Mar 18th, 2010 02:23 am |
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Most center pivoted steel ventilators can be removed by just tilting (opening) them half way and then pulling upwards. You may have to "jiggle" the unit a bit to free it up and to align the pivots. A little WD40 helps.
If that does not work and you really need the operator, then your only choice is to remove the entire unit from the masonry frame.
Or, if it's just the leaded glass panel you need, then.... chip away the old glazing.
Hope this helps.
Good luck,
Roberto
Serpentino Studio
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Ecclesial
AGG Member
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Thu Mar 18th, 2010 02:30 am |
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Thank you for your response.
These will definitely not just lift out. As I have said, the frame extraction will ruin the plaster in the wall. We have currently been removing the panels from the vents, but I would much rather provide a proper operator restoration out of the frame.
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mmezalick
AGG Member
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Posted: Thu Mar 18th, 2010 07:28 am |
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In my opinion the vent was set into the rough opening and the plaster was finished up to the steel frame. Removing the entire unit WILL mean removing the plaster. It does look as if you do have a vent where the "pivot" is a welded pin attached to the operator as you have indicated.
We had a similar situation where there was interior marble finishing up to the steel frame. Lucky for us we were removing the entire steel frame and replacing it with newly designed wooden units.
I think what you are doing is the best that can be done, in this case.
Michael
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Ecclesial
AGG Member
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Thu Mar 18th, 2010 02:00 pm |
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Grateful for your response.
I still have hope that someone will have that magical solution to simplify my life.
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mmezalick
AGG Member
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Posted: Thu Mar 18th, 2010 08:15 pm |
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There is one way that this could be done. It's not easy but it is a possibility. You could cut the pivot and then you would be able to slide the operator out.
Re-pinning the operator would be to add a bolt where the original pin was.
Michael
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Ecclesial
AGG Member
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Thu Mar 18th, 2010 08:23 pm |
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The pivot is about one and a half inches thick. There would be no way to repair it once it is cut since there is an outer hub and some kind of inner hub.
Thanks for the reply.
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Rebecca
Administrator
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Posted: Thu Mar 18th, 2010 10:14 pm |
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Do you have more pictures?
Rebecca
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Ecclesial
AGG Member
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Thu Mar 18th, 2010 10:39 pm |
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I know better pictures would help. Good idea. I am going to the church again next week and will post better photos then.
Thanks everyone!
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Vic
AGG Member
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Posted: Mon Mar 22nd, 2010 08:11 pm |
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I have seen some vent where the pivot pin is a screw. You need to remove the glass to get to it
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Ecclesial
AGG Member
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Mon Mar 22nd, 2010 08:14 pm |
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Thank you Vic,
The men have removed some of the vent windows. I am scheduled to go there tomorrow. I will take a close look and get some pictures too.
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Ecclesial
AGG Member
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Posted: Thu Mar 25th, 2010 02:09 am |
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I have returned from the job site and have some photos. I am adding multiple photos to see if anyone knows how these operators can be removed without removing the frames and without drilling out the peened over bolts.
Solve my problem and I will offer you free glass from your favorite supplier if you can get them go give it to you.
I do not know how to add multiple photos so I will post them on the following replies.
Attached Image (viewed 56 times):
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Ecclesial
AGG Member
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Thu Mar 25th, 2010 02:11 am |
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Ecclesial
AGG Member
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Posted: Thu Mar 25th, 2010 02:12 am |
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Ecclesial
AGG Member
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Thu Mar 25th, 2010 02:13 am |
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Ecclesial
AGG Member
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Posted: Thu Mar 25th, 2010 02:14 am |
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The pencil in this one is showing a floating crescent piece. Remember the outside which cannot show well in the photos is like a solid hub that connect the pieces that show on both sides of the operator.
Attached Image (viewed 58 times):
 Last edited on Thu Mar 25th, 2010 02:17 am by Ecclesial
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mmezalick
AGG Member
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Thu Mar 25th, 2010 07:31 am |
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I doubt that there is a good solution to your problem.
Michael
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Vic
AGG Member
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Posted: Thu Mar 25th, 2010 10:20 pm |
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| Why do they need to come out?
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Ecclesial
AGG Member
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Sat Mar 27th, 2010 12:23 am |
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Why do they need to come out?
Two reasons, one worse than the other.
One minor reason is that I like to powder coat the frames and return them. They last so much longer and look so good.
Second reason is for the extraction of the upper panel. When the church was built, the windows were placed on the inside of the brick with bent nails to hold them in. The inside walls were made thicker with red clay tiles mortared roughly and then the plasterers came in and cemented and plastered directly to the windows. There is no channel except what we are able to chisel out. the walls are eight inches thick to the inside and six inches thick to the outside and the panels remove from the vent tops to the outside. The nightmare of removal would be so much easier if the vent frames were not in the way.
Just love the tough ones, keeps the mind young.
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mmezalick
AGG Member
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Posted: Sun Mar 28th, 2010 03:39 pm |
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John,
I'm starting a project where I will be removing similar frame and vent to be replaced with new aluminum frames.
I was told that my projects frames were made by Crittall from England.
Maybe your as well. If you can wait a month I could let you know if there's a good solution.
Michael
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