American Glass Guild Discussion Board Home
Home Search search Menu menu Not logged in - Login | Register

Tiffany restoration/Old Miss/Oxford, MS
 Moderated by: Rebecca
 New Topic   Reply   Printer Friendly 
 Rate Topic 
AuthorPost
 Posted: Fri Dec 1st, 2017 09:15 pm
   PM  Quote  Reply 
1st Post
Krueger
Senior Advisor
 

Joined: Sat Oct 7th, 2006
Location: Hartland, Michigan
Posts: 3230
Status: 
Online

  back to top

A Tiffany stained glass windows on a stairwell at Ole Miss......Oxford Mississippi...and they have the original bill of sale.

https://www.olemissalumni.com/ventress-hall-restored/

http://libarts.olemiss.edu/tiffany-stained-glass-window/


After a water pipe broken the building was cleaned ...the window went for cleaning/restoration by Pearl River Art Glass, owned by Andrew Young.

http://libarts.olemiss.edu/tiffany-stained-glass-window/


http://pearlriverglass.com/overview/



 Posted: Sat Dec 2nd, 2017 09:59 pm
   PM  Quote  Reply 
2nd Post
artfem
Founder


Joined: Mon Oct 9th, 2006
Location: Annandale, New Jersey USA
Posts: 331
Status: 
Offline

  back to top

I would love to see more photos of the window. That is a strange Tiffany window. I appreciate the bill of sale, but many things about the window seem wrong.



 Posted: Sun Dec 3rd, 2017 12:27 am
   PM  Quote  Reply 
3rd Post
Roberto
AGG Member


Joined: Tue Sep 12th, 2006
Location: Needham, Massachusetts USA
Posts: 146
Status: 
Offline

  back to top

While I agree with Art that judging solely from these photos, I would not attribute this window to the Tiffany Studio either. It reminds me more of Sperry’s work rather than Tiffany. However, the window is listed in Wayne Boucher’s census as being designed by the Tiffany studio.

See link:
http://www.cambridge2000.com/tiffany/html/site/25.3.1.html

Roberto
Serpentino Studio



 Posted: Sun Dec 3rd, 2017 12:58 am
   PM  Quote  Reply 
4th Post
John Emery
AGG Member
 

Joined: Sat Dec 29th, 2012
Location:  
Posts: 74
Status: 
Offline

  back to top

Considering that Louis Comfort Tiffany did not establish his Corona foundry until 1893 or so, and the date of this is supposed to be 1891, the amount of painting and firing in the windows could possibly be explained away as early work, perhaps.  Indeed, the border systems and top portion of the windows look quite "Tiffanesque" while the rest of the work simply doesn't.  This project, among others, might well have influenced Tiffany early on into his position as being apposed to painting and firing in principle, preferring the "true color" to be in the glass itself rather than applied to the surface.  OR, it could be that Tiffany & Co only handled the practical end of the deal in a supervisory mode - the paperwork, contracts, etc.. (and some other group actually did the work)...One can only speculate....

Last edited on Sun Dec 3rd, 2017 12:58 am by John Emery



 Posted: Sun Dec 3rd, 2017 04:15 am
   PM  Quote  Reply 
5th Post
Vic
Founder


Joined: Thu Sep 14th, 2006
Location: Bronxville, New York USA
Posts: 782
Status: 
Offline

  back to top

more photos
http://tinytravelsthroughmississippi.blogspot.com/2011/08/oxford.html

Attached Image (viewed 41 times):

Tiff.jpg

Last edited on Sun Dec 3rd, 2017 04:26 am by Vic



 Posted: Sun Dec 3rd, 2017 09:27 am
   PM  Quote  Reply 
6th Post
wab
Non AGG Member
 

Joined: Thu Mar 27th, 2014
Location: Cambridge, United Kingdom
Posts: 188
Status: 
Offline

  back to top

The contemporaneous documentation for the window is pretty thin.

The university does not even seem to know whether the window was "created" in 1890 or 1891, which presumably means they don't have any newspaper reports to go by (it's hard to believe this wasn't covered somewhere, though).

There is an entry for the "Soldiers Memorial Window" at the University of Mississippi both in the 1897 and 1910 list of windows that the Tiffany company published.

And there is that 1891 receipt (which would indicate that the window was installed in 1891).

And as John mentions, this is pre-1893, and those windows were a bit quirkier. (Pre Corona and pre Frederick Wilson.)

The earliest mention I have found so far of the window (but no mention of Tiffany) was in a 1904 article about confederate monuments and cemeteries.

That 1904 article says that "the ladies" were raising money for a monument already in the late 1870s, but lost the money when some bank went bust, so had to start again.

Wayne



 Posted: Sun Dec 3rd, 2017 04:13 pm
   PM  Quote  Reply 
7th Post
Krueger
Senior Advisor
 

Joined: Sat Oct 7th, 2006
Location: Hartland, Michigan
Posts: 3230
Status: 
Online

  back to top

Interesting that this window has elicited several responses......at least we know people are reading!!!

After Art's first comment, I looked at the window more closely and noted it has a lot of larger pieces of glass, not smaller pieces that would "shade" and add dimension...and all the painted faces on the military people in the right panel...interesting for those of you doing this additional research.

Barbara in Michigan



 Posted: Sun Dec 3rd, 2017 04:35 pm
   PM  Quote  Reply 
8th Post
artfem
Founder


Joined: Mon Oct 9th, 2006
Location: Annandale, New Jersey USA
Posts: 331
Status: 
Offline

  back to top

Thanks for the photos Vic. I just don't see much that screams Tiffany to me about this window, so much paint. But, it is very difficult to prove something isn't something, especially with the bill of sale. And the earlier windows were quirky, but also tended to be more crude and not as well defined. It would be interesting to research if there was ever a fire or some catastrophic damage to the building after the 1891 date that may have resulted in a remake of the window.



 Posted: Sun Dec 3rd, 2017 05:31 pm
   PM  Quote  Reply 
9th Post
Krueger
Senior Advisor
 

Joined: Sat Oct 7th, 2006
Location: Hartland, Michigan
Posts: 3230
Status: 
Online

  back to top

yes, damage to building, but in 2001 according to this.

https://www.olemissalumni.com/ventress-hall-restored/

doesn't say if the window was worked on after that...but it was Pearl River that did some work



 Posted: Sun Dec 3rd, 2017 05:36 pm
   PM  Quote  Reply 
10th Post
wab
Non AGG Member
 

Joined: Thu Mar 27th, 2014
Location: Cambridge, United Kingdom
Posts: 188
Status: 
Offline

  back to top

2011 (and presumably 2012), not 2001. Which is significant because those blog photos that Vic referenced pre-date that restoration.

Wayne



 Posted: Sun Dec 3rd, 2017 05:44 pm
   PM  Quote  Reply 
11th Post
Krueger
Senior Advisor
 

Joined: Sat Oct 7th, 2006
Location: Hartland, Michigan
Posts: 3230
Status: 
Online

  back to top

sorry about that typo....2011......and, how many times have we heard a certain window is/was by Tiffany STudio, by someone's grandmother, or just word of mouth.....the invoices make it more interesting.......and.....perhaps Wayne has archival photos that would be window made during the same time frame as the Mississippi window, to compare the style, etc.



 Posted: Sun Dec 3rd, 2017 06:08 pm
   PM  Quote  Reply 
12th Post
wab
Non AGG Member
 

Joined: Thu Mar 27th, 2014
Location: Cambridge, United Kingdom
Posts: 188
Status: 
Offline

  back to top

I don't remember anything quite like that for 1891 (or similar era) windows. I'd guess that the client said they had $506.50 and Tiffany said that for that budget you get what you see. Although it would be interesting to know if that building did have any previous damage. It was originally the library and then the law building, before its current incarnation. The university newspaper doesn't seem to have much in the way of archives online, unfortunately.

Wayne



 Posted: Sun Dec 3rd, 2017 08:00 pm
   PM  Quote  Reply 
13th Post
Krueger
Senior Advisor
 

Joined: Sat Oct 7th, 2006
Location: Hartland, Michigan
Posts: 3230
Status: 
Online

  back to top

I sent a note to Andy Young at Pearl River in Jackson, MS.......will let you know when I hear back...



 Posted: Tue Dec 5th, 2017 06:39 pm
   PM  Quote  Reply 
14th Post
Krueger
Senior Advisor
 

Joined: Sat Oct 7th, 2006
Location: Hartland, Michigan
Posts: 3230
Status: 
Online

  back to top

FROM ANDY YOUNG, PEARL RIVER ST. GL, JACKSON, MS

I know that the Civil War is not exactly free of controversy currently, and I suppose for the last 150 years as well.

But the window in interesting because it depicts the forming of the brigade from faculty and students that fought in Gettysburg at the Pickets Charge.

One of the panels shows the students in uniform against the backdrop of the Barnard Observatory, the newest building on campus at the time.

The Barnard Observatory still exists on campus.

The University of Mississippi is trying to change the "mascot" from Colonel Reb to something more politically correct, with little success.

They tried the bear on for awhile but it was not welcome change. One of William Faulkner's short novels "The Bear" I guess was the reasoning.....

I cannot find better pictures than the one I included but I hope to find more to send later of the window.


Andy



 Posted: Tue Dec 19th, 2017 05:28 pm
   PM  Quote  Reply 
15th Post
Krueger
Senior Advisor
 

Joined: Sat Oct 7th, 2006
Location: Hartland, Michigan
Posts: 3230
Status: 
Online

  back to top

One thing that was not mentioned during the earlier discussion about this window in Mississippi, was the address on the receipt........was that the address for the Tiffany firm at the time?

http://libarts.olemiss.edu/tiffany-stained-glass-window/



Barbara in Michigan

Last edited on Tue Dec 19th, 2017 05:29 pm by Krueger



 Posted: Tue Dec 19th, 2017 05:36 pm
   PM  Quote  Reply 
16th Post
wab
Non AGG Member
 

Joined: Thu Mar 27th, 2014
Location: Cambridge, United Kingdom
Posts: 188
Status: 
Offline

  back to top

Yes, 333 upwards (to 335, later 341) Fourth Avenue was the address from 1881 (Associated Artists) up to at least 1904 (Tiffany Studios), just looking at the Morse Museum chronology:

http://www.morsemuseum.org/chronology

Wayne



 Posted: Tue Dec 19th, 2017 06:54 pm
   PM  Quote  Reply 
17th Post
Krueger
Senior Advisor
 

Joined: Sat Oct 7th, 2006
Location: Hartland, Michigan
Posts: 3230
Status: 
Online

  back to top

Wayne mentioned the Morse Museum has a time line on their web site about Louis C. Tiffany ......if you are interested in looking at it, save 30 minutes, at least, to look at it!!!!! and I only got to 1900!!

it covers reported incidents for his personal life, travel he did, and professional accomplishments which include painting exhibitions, window designing/installation, etc. and every dated item has a source noted.

One item that caught my eye was October 1894 mention of the use of copper foiling......

will have to finish reading it at some later time!!



 Current time is 08:03 pm
Top




UltraBB 1.17 Copyright © 2007-2011 Data 1 Systems